Concerning Teamwork...

[TheTrojanBunny]

I don't mean to sound bossy or look like I'm overstepping my authority, but alot of the newer OcR recruits do not seem to understand this rather simple concept. It is not that I am calling them out because they suck, individually, they are fairly skilled. But they need to understand that they aren't Rambo, and that if they want to win, they need to work together. That being said, most of them do know the callouts, but they seem to forget these concepts.

1. You need to be more aware of their surroundings, I cannot be the eyes and ears of the entire team, and as much as I wish I can do it, I can't.
2. You call out people, and predict where they are going. This is an excellent step, but if you just let the guy scurry off on most occasions, then that's a problem. If you teamshoot, they have a much better chance of killing the guy which just might be the winning point for a slayer, or the key to keeping the other team from scoring the flag.
3. You need to stay in your setup position. Lets say we're playing Midship CTF, and you happen to be the P2 man. Lets say a guy sneaks in from P1, and rushes our base from underneath. You see him, and follow him, and kill him. Now you have just made 2 grevious mistakes. A: You have chased a wounded animal that could of easily killed you, and B: You left your setup position, so while your off chasing that one guy, your teammates are eating BR sandwiches with nade-colas because you aren't covering them, and by the time you are up there, their pretty much dead.
3a. This is not to say there are certain times you should leave your position, if you leave it (unless your team is altering their setup), make it a priority to get back there, but keep alert while doing so.
4. Tunnel Vision. I sometimes suffer from it myself, but it is a very unsmart thing to do. Lets say it's Lockout Oddball. Your team is at Lift 2 (or top blue or whatever you want to call it) Lets say you and your team kill the other team completely except for one guy, who is not in a position to engage you. You tell your team your going for the ball. But as you hit X to grab it, one of your teammates is RIGHT NEXT TO YOU. You think, well, as long as we have the ball..., but in true fashion, the other team gets a lucky spawn, and you and your mate get killed outright. Once again, 2 glaring mistakes, not only leaving your setup area, but the tunnel vision gets two of you killed instead of one, and leaves your team open to counterattack. Always try to minimize casualties.
4a. For those who want to say they need to be close to cover the ball guy, you can do that just as easily from long range if your other teammates are helping.
5. Fire masking. I'm pretty sure y'all know the meaning of this. If you get in front of your teammates, you aren't helping them, their wasting ammo on your sheilds. It's bad enough you have host and two more BRs on your case, but with your teammate accidentally putting shots into you, your dead. This is most often the case in a sniper setup. What usually happens is two guys roam S2, one is S3/shortcut with the sniper, and one covers underglass from S1. The problem is at S2, sometimes the two guys there will hit eachother if a guy rushes, say Shortcut from the Library Entrance. Or a guy will head S3, right in front of his sniper weilding teammate when he took shots from B2 and open ramp.
6. Offensive Nades. What I really noticed from playing with some people, and from analyzing my own videos from a while back, is that instead of BRing someone, I or someone else tossed nades in the hopes of getting a Million to one stick on them. Don't think of nades as rifles, think of them as traps. Try to force your targets into your grenades.

I hope this helps in some way or form. Please note that I'm not trying to take Envy's or and of the OL's job by taking this tone, and I don't want to pretty much be labled the clan a-hole, I just want to help the members of OcR.

Trojan
Teamshooting FTW

[Hunter501]

Yeah, you have taught me well so far, and both of us make a good team

[Godlywayz SBG]

We had some similiar problems at SBG with the lack of people's teamwork. A couple posts like this were made, but the biggest thing that helped was having several of our top guys go in and run a game, and sort of "coach" them. It can be much easier to point things and teach someone while you're in the moment. Since the posts and the training session we've seen some good improvement.
I hope it goes as well for you guys.

[OcR Ronin]

Everything you said is true, but there are only two ways go gain this information. One is to have the experience of thousands of games and the other is to recieve coaching and support from other members who have already played these thousands of games. One of the biggest problems in this clan is the tendency to get these groups going where no one is inviting anyone new to play and are instead going with people they already know. Yeah, maybe you do work better with a few particular members and yeah, maybe you want people on your team that you know are REALLY good and thus insure the win, but we need to be more friendly and make the new members feel welcome.

[TheTrojanBunny]

Which is why any members, new or old, need some assistance with teamwork, I would be more than happy to assist them. They just need to send me a Friend Request that says "OcR" in the message.

Trojan
Even today those kids send me random FRs

[i AwoN i]

Chya Aaecus I've been here like a year the only people I played with often were c and lemmi I haven't even played with more than half the people here.

[Hunter501]

Which is why any members, new or old, need some assistance with teamwork, I would be more than happy to assist them. They just need to send me a Friend Request that says "OcR" in the message.

Trojan
Even today those kids send me random FRs

Maybe we could have a little coaching thing Trojan?

[TheTrojanBunny]

Isn't that what I just said? :P

Trojan
Will coach anyone in OcR as long as they are willing to learn

[Lzk HellSpawn]

Isn't that what I just said? :P

Trojan
Will coach anyone in OcR as long as they are willing to learn

Im in!!!!

I need to brush up on my game though. I havn't played H2 in so long since I got my 360. It's not that I left it behind it's just that I noticed a huge difference playing it with a 360 controller vs the original xbox controller. I am too used to the previous version while playing Halo. I just got to get used to using the shoulder buttons to communicate and switch grenades, it's just too much of a habit I developed using the Xbox controller. On another side I feel a little awkward aiming and such considering the controller has been revamped and such. I am not moaning or anything, but I am just saying it's gonna take sometime getting used to. I am pretty sure other people out there have this same problem as well. :/

[Letthe]

Also I prefer people that don't leave during a Matching Making game for no reason nor making one up.

[OcR Envy]

I always felt there really should only be 1 person calling out positions but thats just my personal opinion. 4 people talking gets a little confusing.

[ixi xizor ixi]

well it would be better for having four ppl calling out. today me and trojan were in MM team hardcore and we were getting cheated bc it was oddball on warlock they threw the ball out of the map. it made me mad to the point where i stop doing callouts and trying to setup. we never once got setup to take them out.
Trojan could i help you out with this? since kevin told me its hard to coach more than one person when all the people in the room needed to be coach.

[TheTrojanBunny]

I would be very happy to have you assisting me Xizor. To anyone who wants to get the MLG stuff with hard experience, tomorrow, we will be drilling Midship CTF.

[ixi xizor ixi]

Yea. ok the thing is that now after this trojan you have to work on our DUALTAGE!!!!!!

I wanna see it!

[p0tat0 5alad]

I always felt there really should only be 1 person calling out positions but thats just my personal opinion. 4 people talking gets a little confusing.

It does get confusing but it helps because 4 people will see more than one. But you will rarely come across a team that all four people are constant communicators. Majority of teams have their objective & support players communicate just for the simple fact that they should know their immediate surroundings and the amount of people still alive. Plus they aren't constantly in battles so they have time to talk.

[OcR Dragon]

I always wanted to work on a strat to where if a certain member calls out a position that everyone puts fire on that one guy, even if they see some one else, so your most likely to get the kill like lets say from B-3 to S-2/3. But I see a lot of people shooting at multiple people instead of putting there fire on one guy and getting the kill. That's some thing I always wanted to work on with a team, but never got the chance.

[OcR FoRk]

Great write up Trojan.

[TN GUNRUNNER]

ya i under stand were all of you are coming from and team work is somthin that you have to work at call outs and stuff are basic this that help build team work but you have to have good team work to team br

[Lzk HellSpawn]

On a further note(incase anyone didn't read my previous post) I am also sick and tired of getting paired up with team mates who apparentely have mics but don't say a word the entire match. Then after we are down 10 to 13, two of them quit!!

SO WHAT?!!?!? WE CAN MAKE A COMEBACK!! -_____-

[TN GUNRUNNER]

spaw if you like playing mm and dont want any quiters send me a Fr and well play

[I TidalWave I]

I feel the same way bunny and when i play with you i will do my best to call out and listen

[GodofDeathKB]

I feel so special. My boys have all grown up now *Tear*.


Im glad youre passing some training along to the others. If you need any help let me know. Ill be sort of busy the next few days getting a few people ready for Dallas and Alpha has had me glued to his VoD trying to figgure out what they are doing wrong, but ive got it figgured out now.


I will be back on by tonight so just hit me up if youre still doing this, ill help if im free and you want some assistance.

[ixi xizor ixi]

Im not sure when we are going to have our next practice kevin but ill keep you posted. and thanks for the help. Hey i might need a little practice bc i am pretty sure im going to Chicago.

and thanks for all the help kevin.

[GodofDeathKB]

FFA or 4 vs 4? If you need help ill be there, but you already know my conditions that I require as a trianer.

[ixi xizor ixi]

4v4. yea i know your conditions. Maybe FFA. as you know i suck in both areas (especially FFA) i need to get more communication and i also need help breaking a few strategies on a few maps like warlock and midship. sanctuary i haven't really came across a strategy other than holding ring which i kinda know how to break it.

[TheTrojanBunny]

Heyo Kevin! Long time no see eh? If at all possible, I would like to have some FFA training (for orlando), and 4v4, since I may or may not (tentative pending folk's approval) be going to Dallas w/ About The Money.

Trojan
Is always happy to play with anyone

[GodofDeathKB]

Its kinda late to go to Dallas, I think they all sold out. If you went to dallas and I had time, id be honored to coach you though if you'd have me. I was going to come up and help out with Finessed and FF but since no one I know is going its not any fun being alone for 3 days with no one to talk to.

[TheTrojanBunny]

Well, I may or may not. I know for sure that I'll probably go to Orlando, as for Dallas, I still need to work out the fine details. If AtM goes to Orlando, and your there, I personally would be happy to have you as our coach.

[ixi xizor ixi]

you with ATM?

[TheTrojanBunny]

Maybe, but I think it is going to happen.

[OcR FoRk]

Good job Bunny, way to step it up. I noticed you had improved, and apparently AtM has as well. Good luck.

[Wolfboy]

Actually bunny we're probably going to pick up Ambience

[TheTrojanBunny]

That's cool. I wish y'all luck if you go with him. If you do need me for an online tourney, or for Orlando or anything like that, I'm here.

[Wolfboy]

actually there probably won't be an AtM after dallas unless we get this sponsorship deal, because apparently WoW engulfs everything it comes in contact with....

[i AwoN i]

Wait about this whole teamwork thing...when you guys play HC are you actually thinking all of that stuff about angles spawnpoints ect etc etc etc?
I don't get it, I watched that oddball lockout vid with the guy in the window dictating all of this sophistocated angles from standing in a certain spot or predicting spawns or angles your team can shoot from from his spot...

I used to play 6v6 with this guy in particular
http://www.bungie.net/Account/Profile.aspx?player=SyCo+SoLdiEr+X
He sounded like he was drunk half the time and pretty much just ran around pissing on people, a lot of other guys I played high ranks in 6v6 had ridiculously high ranks in other playlists including HC but I KNOW none of them do anything complicated when they play? I get to mid20s easy then cant rank up anymore because I get teamshot the hell out of. : (

[OcR Dragon]

Yeah A1, knowing all of the angles of a map is a huge strat. The whole thing behind the ball guy standing in the window is mainly to call out positions and assist on any team shooting. From the library window you can see a lot, under glass, blue room, top of lift, top mid, and S2. Putting the ball guy there frees a space, because before a normal guy would stand there and guard the ball guy, but now they have a few options on where they can stand. I prefer a guy in B1, B2, library window with ball, and B-3 with snipe. That can be a pretty hard set up to break if you all know what your doing.

[i AwoN i]

Haha see I have kept up with syco and all those guys in btb and 6v6 because on big maps like that I KNOW where they would spawn, no suprises. I held my own in a bunch of 1v1s with them (BR I mean) pretty easy. I go into HC at mid20s and am playing people I know are bad, but I'll barely go positive because I have no idea how to play.

I was taking summer classes in college so I can transfer out faster, they're done tuesday I'll have a lot of time to play halo and if anybody wants to show me the ropes I would really appreciate it because without any help I am looost. To make it worse my FL is trash I lost all 3-4 of my old tags. Worst comes to worse I usually go positive mid20s, especially if I'm with a good team. I'll listen religiously and be glad to learn whatever position is easiest /suggested. Paybacks I can get anybody that wants a high rank in 6v6 or btb for H3 up there right quick.

[TheTrojanBunny]

Once I get a new mic, I would be happy to help you out. I know that from playing with you, you have an incredible BR, but you don't really use it to support your team, you mainly get into alot of 1v1 BR duels. That won't fly in a serious MLG Team Game, because if you try to do that to a team that is setup, their teamshoot will tear you to shreds. Probably a good spot for you A1, would be a supporting position, such as the top of a base or P2.

[i AwoN i]

Cool thanks a bunch. I was stupid I always thought "whatever I know I can hang with them in my playlists so that just means they play smarter /more /with a better team". Never even thought that playing smarter could out-weigh raw skill as much as it seems to.

I get games all the time where I go way negative like 5 and 15 but all my kills would be straight 1v1s and all my deaths would be from getting teamshot or spawning with a grenade under my feet, I can see how people get so into MLG now that I am starting to learn about how deep it can get strategically.

I need to get a cc, looking over old games is a great way to get better. For example on warlock, if I'm under the ramp and lose my shields out of habit I throw a grenade at the right corner, they jump and move to the left and kill me barely taking any damage from the grenade, what a waste. I just realized, hey, why don't I ricotche the grenade off the left wall and jump to the left? They have to go to the left to get the last headshot, if the grenade comes from a better angle it will do more damage, maybe suprise them and me jumping to the left instead of backwards has a better chance of catching them off gaurd. Stuff like that...hard to think of /remember all that in-game for me though.

[TheTrojanBunny]

That is excellent thinking man. But a better option would be to do this. Lob the nade to the left, but jump over to the right. In most cases, the guy will be expecting you to be under the ramp still, and won't see your back-headshot coming.

[OcR Prunk]

I brought this up b4 but it didnt get as much publicity as it did now. Im glad u brought it up Trojan, we havnt had a good clan practice night for a long time now. And we've gained a lot of new members who dont know the strategies. We need to actually use clan nights as a learingin expierience so we can perform better.

[TheTrojanBunny]

It's my pleasure Prunk.

[i AwoN i]

That is excellent thinking man. But a better option would be to do this. Lob the nade to the left, but jump over to the right. In most cases, the guy will be expecting you to be under the ramp still, and won't see your back-headshot coming.


Yeah I meant like they are around tele and if you ran foward you'd just run to them...so I go back around the corner then out of habit I toss the nade at the right corner jump back and get headshotted. It just seems like that happens at least once every warlock game maybe thats because I don't know how to play or what hah. Also there are some times I get trigger happy and shoot right away, like my team will be 2 guys down and I'll see a couple of them and just try to take them all out even though I know I can't, and most of the time right after I shoot I'm like wow what a bad idea...just hard to keep adjusting so quick and so often for me.

Also about the grenades I've been trying to cross toss them up close more often. Like far away I get some dirty ricotches but anything up close out of habit I throw it right under their feet or their immediate direction instead of ricotche or using the grenade to bottle them up somewhere. Actually for slayer a lot of the time to play conservatively and not die I just throw base-base nades and run around collecting all of the nades on my side of the map, I usually go at least +5 like that but I rarely break 10 kills playing that way.

[Lzk HellSpawn]

spawn if you like playing mm and dont want any quiters send me a Fr and well play

Thanks, will do. However I just got a 360 and in my previous post in this thread I have notified it's a huge change of using the original Xbox controller vs the 360 one. I am more interested in taking advantage of the 360 opportunities now. I am just going to retire from Halo 2 as of now. With halo 3 approaching I guess I can wait a few more months,because I would hate to start from scratch again on account of the controller changes Halo 3 will face. I will send you a FR, but I shall return to Halo once the 3rd installment arrives.

Spawn

[TheTrojanBunny]

A1, at close range, DO NOT use those grenades unless you know you have time to conpensate if you miss or it does no damage. A good way would be to short bounce or reflect a grenade off a nearby wall or something and then BR your opponent in a way that forces him into the grenade. Nade traps work alot better than random grenades.